October 03, 2005

FAITH

I went back to the church I grew up in on Sunday. Partly because it makes my mum happy and partly because I still have genuine friends there. She can't really cope with a whole service and nods off but someone picks her up from where she lives every Sunday. They are a really nice bunch. She can't move around too well these days.

The long running battle between the more "pentecostal" christians and the more orthodox ones seems to have been won hands down by the "happy clappys." The side I was on incidentally.

When I hear about the internal arguments of Mr Hamza's supporters I know from personal experience what this is like. Intense relationships build up around the "God" concept of any denomination. My sister is still scarred by the attitude of the "orthodox" christians we grew up with. She got pregnant at 15 and married the father under pressure. She is now happily married to someone else, as is the father of her two kids.

"___ and ___ have sinned." said the pastor at their wedding.

I had forgotten about this. My auntie, who isn't religious told me about it recently. I think she wanted to throw a hymn book at him.

Sitting in her 4X4 yesterday ---- gave me a massive tirade against illegal imigrants and then burst into tears. I thought she was going to crash the car. She is in a very hard job where she see's the arse end of society 40 hours a week. I know that outside London the racial bubble we exist in here bursts.

The orthodox pastor left the church a while ago, along with most of his family. I think he was quite depressed. I don't hold anything against him personaly, though I know he voted conservative and had a different perspective on christianity to the one that I held. The more emotional members of his congregation struggled with his authoritarian nature but I know that he struggled with it himself too. I remember he gave me a genuine hug at my fathers funeral which meant a lot to me and he also visited my mum in hospital not too long back. Haven't seen the guy for years myself.

A much more "liberated" pastor has taken over and a lot has changed at the church. I think everyone my sister is bitter about has left. The format of the service is basically the same but things are more relaxed and informal around the edges and this is reflected in the way the building is set up now. There was a genuinely warm atmosphere on Sunday.

They are part of the interdenominational "Alpha" course set up in this country, where people are given a gentle introduction to christianity. After the service the pastor suggested I go on one. There isn't much I don't know about christianity, as I used to preach it myself. I need the "Beta" course maybe.

Another lady I didn't know joined us and we got talking about what I was doing.

"So what do you make films about?" she asked.

(I like answering this one)

"Fundamental Islam." I said. (always a show stopper) "You've seen the guy with the hooks on TV? Him and his friends and family."

"So what do you think?" she asked.

"I think I want to film exactly what the guys say it is. What they believe. What they are about."

She enquired as to the state of my faith. I agreed that my christianity had "lapsed" . I told her that I was unhappy with any religion which divided between saved and lost.

"The trouble is the devil lies to us." she said.

"Hmmm..." I said. "The Islamists I speak to have a similar concept of "the Devil"...hmmm..."Evil" with a unified personality. I don't know..."

"What do you believe now?" she asked me.

I gave her my stock answer to that one.

"I don't believe in belief. There either is or there isn't a "God" "Budha" or "Devil". Whether I believe or not, that is the only fact I know."

"I suppose it takes faith" she said.

"Yes. Faith. Exactly. Faith."


"Let him who is without sin cast the first stone MOTHERFUCKER..." Jesus H. (New Malung Version)

8 comments:

boudica of suburbia said...

What you said about your sisters wedding, although I don't want to trivialise it, reminded me of the wedding-scene in Riding In Cars With Boys. Don't know why its relevent.. it isn't at all really.

xxB

DAVE BONES said...

Bloody hell! another UK blogger! I thought they were a myth! I haven't seen the film. I don't get to talk to my sister often enough, but when we do she has a lot to unburden and I can totally see why. She is ace.

Anonymous said...

i love this post dave. i so relate to it. i wish you would post more personal posts like this one.

DAVE BONES said...

I said once a long time ago that if I blogged as honestly as you do about my personal life you'd all be in tears!

Cheers tequilita babes! I have to write something for you and Stef occasionaly eh?

DAVE BONES said...

Credibility? Hey Mike! Someones accusing me of credibility again!!!

(sorry we dealt with the credibility issue here (3rd para)

No seriously, you are quite right. I do understand how it feels to cling onto beliefs out of a book to a level which brings persecution.

My own christianity is totally behind my interest in the story of fundamental islam.

I thought that you were one of the happy clappy ones. You are very unjudgemental. Good for you. That is what drew me to Sparkle.

Christians who talk to me because they give a shit are fine by me. If the pastor didn't enquire as to the state of my soul on his home turf he wouldn't be doing his job properly.

The Scrutinator said...

Great post, mate!

Not a "happy clappy" (pentecostal) myself, but I think I identify more with them than with the "orthodox" folks you describe.

Give us more of your story!

DAVE BONES said...

Nice one MR. Scrutinator have you had time to take up the TAG yet yourself?

I've just had a look and can see you haven't.

I didn't mean that "happy clappy" was necessarily better than "orthadox" service wise.

Its just people who are judgemental without caring who make me see red.

I caught your post about my journey from "bible believer" to "quality control" member in my inbox although I havent tracked down where you posted it.

I very rarely post on the QCA, I don't really share the philosophy and if I start filming with anymore christians (something I cant blog about yet) I'm going to have to pull my membership as the liberal drug references are already hard to take for one of them.

You lot tagging along is giving me "credibility" in their eyes, thanks!

I apreciate it.

Indigobusiness said...


<< "I don't believe in belief.
<< There either is or there isn't
<< a "God" "Budha" or "Devil". Whether
<< I believe or not, that is the only
<< fact I know."


There is or there isn't a consensus on what "God" means.